Live Nation Entertainment says it knows many music and sports fans hate the company and blame it — and subsidiary Ticketmaster — for sky-high ticket prices.
But the executive vice-president of the world’s largest entertainment company insists the conglomerate is not a monopoly and should not be broken up.
“[Fans] have frustrations about the live entertainment market and they associate it especially with Ticketmaster because most people buy their tickets from Ticketmaster,” Dan Wall told CBC News in a wide-ranging interview at Live Nation’s offices in New York.
But Wall defended his company and said he will fight moves to split up Ticketmaster and Live Nation after a recent landmark verdict by a U.S. federal jury.
On April 15, after a six-week trial on anti-trust allegations, the jury found Ticketmaster and Live Nation liable on multiple counts, including operating an anti-competitive monopoly and unlawfully tying together tour promotions, ticketing and operation of venues.
Live Nation executive vice-president Dan Wall says the U.S. federal jury verdict found the company did not monopolize the ‘whole’ primary ticketing market, and is ‘confident’ that, in time, courts will also find that it is not a monopoly.
“It’s frustrating,” Wall said. “I think it’s pretty clear that the states who brought the case along with the federal government asked for a jury trial because it’s a lot easier to win a jury trial than it is a [judge alone] trial in a case like this, particularly against a big corporation. And I’m not happy with the verdict, of course.”
Wall told CBC News that, if necessary, Live Nation will appeal the verdict arguing the plaintiff Attorneys General for 33 states and Washington, D.C. only presented evidence that Ticketmaster corners 20 per cent of the primary ticketing market.
“I don’t call that a monopoly. And I’m actually confident that over time, the courts won’t call that a monopoly,” he said.
Lawyers were back in a New York courtroom Thursday debating how the penalties phase of the case should proceed.
A U.S. jury has found that ticket giants Live Nation and Ticketmaster held an illegal monopoly on ticket sales in several U.S. states. The verdict could cost Live Nation and Ticketmaster hundreds of millions of dollars.
White House meeting
Wall acknowledges that Live Nation’s CEO Michael Rapino met with officials in the Trump White House earlier this year and hammered out a settlement with the federal Department of Justice (DOJ) that would avoid splitting up the company.
But dozens of states refused to go along with the deal and continued the lawsuit seeking stiffer penalties including a potential breakup.
Richard Blumenthal, U.S. Senator from Connecticut and Democrat who conducted a subcommittee investigation of Live Nation and Ticketmaster, is furious with the company’s tactics.
“The DOJ settlement resulted from a corrupt process. It was the outcome of contacts with lobbyists and others who had a strong self-interest,” Blumenthal told CBC News.
Richard Blumenthal, a Democratic U.S. senator who led a subcommittee investigation of Live Nation and Ticketmaster, is frustrated by what he calls the company’s ‘misuse and abuse’ of its market dominance to constrain competition.
“It’s a monopoly because they have control over more than 80 per cent of the combination of ticket selling, venues, artists, and agents.
“There’s an easy solution here, which is to undo or unwind the merger that shouldn’t have been allowed in the first place.”
Wall denies any “sweetheart deals” were cooked up with the White House and says forcing Live Nation to sell off Ticketmaster and allowing it to return to being a standalone ticketing company again is “both legally impossible and a terrible idea.”
Why are ticket prices so high?
Ticket prices soaring into the thousands of dollars to see major artists such Taylor Swift, Bruno Mars, Harry Styles and Bruce Springsteen have prompted outrage and confusion among fans and some politicians.
CBC News pressed Wall on promises the company made back in 2009, when Live Nation sought approval to merge with Ticketmaster. CEO Michael Rapino assured the U.S. Senate anti-trust committee that keeping concerts affordable for fans was a top priority.
“Our motivation is to keep the ticket prices as low as possible and get everyone in the building,” Rapino testified at the time.
Dan Wall insists nothing has changed in Live Nations’ aims, but he says demand for live entertainment has surged and stadium tours and concerts have ballooned in scale and complexity which has driven up prices.
“It is still the priority. But look, we don’t run the world. This is a world of thousands of artists putting on thousands of different shows. They have different levels of popularity. There’s different willingness to pay for those artists.”
Asked why many music and sports fans blame its subsidiary Ticketmaster for sky-high ticket prices, Live Nation executive vice-president Dan Wall says consumers are ‘used to blaming the merchants’ for problems, including those that aren’t its responsibility.
He also says tours used to be subsidized by record companies, but that’s changed since streaming services killed music sales.
“It was all marketing to sell records…. And so the artist is 1778238458 earning most of his or her income from touring and needs to generate the income to do that.”
Platinum and dynamic pricing?
Wall acknowledges Live Nation encourages artists and performers to use dynamic pricing and “platinum” ticket pricing for prime seats.
Dynamic pricing allows event organizers to adjust ticket prices based on demand. “Platinum” ticketing allows promoters to set tiers of different prices based on row and distance from the stage.
“It is not just Live Nation that does this. Everyone in the industry does this, I think there is unanimity in the industry [that it] is for the benefit of the artists and the fans because it creates this spread of pricing.”
For example, some platinum seats for Bruce Springsteen’s Madison Square Gardens concert May 11 are listed for sale at more than $2,000 Cdn, whereas seats further back from the stage sold-out as they were posted for just $400.
“That allows the higher price seats to subsidize a lot more lower price seats.” Wall said.
“It also keeps the money in the productive chain. It goes to the artists. It goes through the members of the band rather than the scalper or someone who’s just gonna buy that ticket up if it is too cheap … and resell it for its actual market value.”
Music industry giant Live Nation reached a settlement with the U.S. Department of Justice on Monday, ending the antitrust trial stemming from the company’s alleged monopoly over concert venues and ticket sales.
Live Nation and Ticketmaster insists it does not use algorithmic pricing to change prices in real-time, but instead uses market data — including prices listed on scalper websites — to estimate the potential a fan will be willing to spend.
“If you’re wealthy and you value the front row, it is absolutely increasing the price for you,” he said.
“But if you’re not one of those people, then the system is also going to work for you by keeping your tickets less expensive than they would otherwise have to be.”
Canada watching closely
Regulators in Canada and around the world are watching the U.S. anti-trust case closely.
The Consumer Council of Canada brought an action in December to the Competition Bureau, similarly seeking to “split up Live Nation and Ticketmaster.”
“We’ve heard loud and clear from Canadian fans that they’re tired of the dominance of Live Nation and Ticketmaster,” said David Sterns, a lawyer who filed the Canadian application.
“What we’re seeking to do is to bring justice to the Canadian market and re-establish competition and probably most importantly get compensation for everybody who’s been overcharged for all these years, all these concerts.”
